Exploring Guyana’s Foodways with Dr. Geoffrey Giddings

Guyanese Culinary Traditions 

From Guyana’s six peoples to the impact of Guyana’s new wealth, and the national dish of pepperpot, Hema and Dr. Geoffrey Giddings discuss the ever-evolving foodways in Guyana. 

Geoffrey, an expert in African American studies and a passionate advocate for Guyanese food culture, delves into the rich history of Guyana, known as the land of six peoples, highlighting the culinary influences from Indigenous, European, African, Indian, Portuguese, and Chinese heritages. He shares personal stories from his early years growing up with his grandmother in Guyana, moving to New York, and his time spent amongst the Imbotero in the Barima-Waini region during his Fulbright research. 

Articles by Dr. Giddings

Food in the “Great Land of Guyana” - Stabroek News
Time to Forge a National Cuisine - Stabroek News
Guyanese Cuisine Culture - Stabroek News
What’s really cooking in Guyana? - Stabroek News

Resources

History of Pepperpot
Dictionary of Caribbean English - Richard Allsopp

More episodes
Exploring Guyana’s Historical Roots with Melissa Goolsarran Ramnauth
WestIndianDiplomacy.com: An interview with Melissa, West Indian historian

Transcript

Geoffrey:   So Guyana is known to be the society of six races or six peoples, certainly six heritages. And there's a lot of history in that. The first is the indigenous, of course. About 9% of the Guyanese population is indigenous.

And then if you go chronologically, the Europeans who did the colonization, bringing Africans afterwards, then bringing Indians from India next, and Madeira, Portuguese and Chinese. And so we've got this mixture of six peoples. 

So the traditions continue. Food culture is never static, by the way. Absolutely never static. The history continues.

[music]

Hema: Geoffrey, thank you so much for joining me today on The Moreish Podcast.

Geoffrey: Thank you very much Hema. Appreciate this opportunity.

Hema: I have been reading some of the articles that you've put out and a little bit about your work, and this is gonna be a really interesting conversation about Guyanese food, food in Guyana, and a little bit of the history of Guyana.

Before we dive right into the conversation, how about you introduce yourself?

Geoffrey: Okay, sure. So my name is Geoffrey Giddings. I have a doctorate degree in African American studies from Temple University. I am Guyanese born, raised since age 13 in New York, lived for a while in Ohio, where I taught at both Antioch College and Central State University, and I am just excited about this new field of mine exploring Guyanese foodways, Guyanese cuisine, if you will.

It's really a pathway into Guyanese culture, and so I'm excited to be, sort of a expat who is trying to give back, who's trying to reverse a bit of the brain drain in this way.

Hema: So you mentioned that you were born and raised in Guyana and moved to the United States around age 13.

Geoffrey: Correct.

Hema: And in some of your writings, you talk about being raised by your grandmother

Geoffrey: Yes.

Hema: and you have a lot of food stories that are related back to that time before you moved to the United States.

Geoffrey: Sure. 

Hema: Was that formative time what led you into the path you are now, which is studying the foodways?

Geoffrey: Absolutely. Absolutely. I think before I started taking foodways seriously, I definitely was a foodie. And so looking back at what caused me to be a foodie, it was certainly, as I think deeply about it, the experiences I had growing up in Guyana, but also growing up in New York, where the traditions continued.

I was left with my grandmother at age three 'cause both parents emigrated ahead of us, and I've written about this as you mentioned, and raised by my grandmother in a time when, most meals were prepared at home, it was a rare occasion that you went out to eat.

So I was always, and I'm, I was a very much a homebody, always very close to my grandmother, the youngest of of the children in the house, and always very close to the, the heart of the house, the, the kitchen, and so would always see the magic, right? That took place in the kitchen that my grandmother wielded.

And then even when I went to New York, my mother was a great cook. My stepfather was also a terrific cook. In fact, at one point I remember thinking my stepfather is a better cook than my mom, he had actually a bit more time to do a lot of cooking, and that was why. And then eventually she emerged. She had a bit of a food business, so I was constantly surrounded by food and the standards of food as well.

So I definitely became a foodie through that process and so many, yeah, so much more, just experiences in Guyana, in terms of how, myself as a kid accessed snacks,natural snacks as snacks rather from neighbourhood neighbours trees and that sort of thing. And the little snackettes that they were always, always around, right?

You can get your plantain chips, you can get your tamarind balls and so on very, very easily.

Hema: You have a little bit of an advantage on me in that you spent some time living in Guyana. My family is Trinidadian, but I was born and raised in Toronto. So I have the experience that you did when you moved to New York, which is the traditions and the foods continued, but just maybe in a slightly different way because we didn't have access to all of the ingredients and all of the things that you would if you were living in the Caribbean.

Geoffrey: Absolutely. Absolutely. So true. It's interesting that I found that in Toronto you had all this amazing stuff that I found that sometimes in New York we didn't have. But certainly the point is that the traditions continue. People always take their culture with them, and one of the easiest things to carry are the memories of food preparation, recipes, and so on, even when certain items could not be attained. Folks were very creative and inventive. They carried their homes with them in this regard, so, certainly,

Hema: I sort of think about it in very light terms of our ancestors who had to adapt once they were taken, brought to the Caribbean. They had to adapt their way of life, their culture, their cooking to what was available to them, which, you know, history that we're gonna talk about today, I feel like my family, your family probably did the same thing, is carry on the traditions in North America with what was available to us.

Geoffrey: Absolutely. So of Guyana, is known to be the society of six races or six peoples, certainly six heritages, right? And there's a lot of history in that. The first is the Indigenous, of course, referred to as Amerindians, and Trinidad has some of that not as much. About 9% of the Guyanese population is Indigenous. Beginning with that, and then if you go chronologically, the Europeans, who did the colonization, bringing Africans afterwards, then bringing Indians from India next, and Madeira Portuguese and Chinese.

And so we've got this, mixture of six peoples. And even today, the traditions are continuing, 'cause there's a growing number of immigrants to Guyana from Venezuela, from Cuba, from Brazil. So the traditions continue. Food culture’s never static, by the way. Absolutely never static. The history continues.

Hema: All of the peoples that you just named, and I was looking at some of the articles that you wrote, you document quite nicely, the influences and the food influences that come from each of those six peoples. I will link those in the uh, for people to go take a look at if they're interested.

I want to start with the Indigenous, the Amerindians, because when we talk about Indigenous people of Guyana that sort of makes it seem like they're onewith group, but that's not actually the case.

Geoffrey: In fact, there are like nine different groups of Indigenous folks in, in Guyana. I most recently spent a lot of time in region one in Guyana, the Barima-Waini region. We've got, in Guyana, 10 different regions administratively, they're all named for their bordering rivers. The Warao people are probably one of the most unique Indigenous groups in Guyana. Their language happens to be a language isolate, and all kinds of interesting things. They have strong ties to all along the coast, you'll find them in French Guyana, Suriname, as well as Venezuela.

And so I had the great opportunity through a Fulbright grant to spend a lot of time there. These communities are very, very tied to the land around them and therefore their foods reflect that. And so it's interesting that our national dish, pepperpot, is owed very strongly to the Indigenous populations.

A lot of them, most of them, are harvesters of cassava, all right, and that's, the cassareep that's important to our pepperpot, is a byproduct of the cassava, which also happens to be native to the area, to South America. So it's very, very fitting. Guyana also pays, a lot of this is not necessarily known, but our flag is called the Golden Arrowhead, and it's a direct homage, if you will, to the Indigenous communities in Guyana.

So pepperpot, and there are various versions of pepperpot as well. There's pepperpot that's made with the cassava water, as opposed to the cassareep. The cassareep is the further along the process of caramelizing the cassava liquid, And of course, so much else is made from cassava, the cassava bread, quinches, so on and so forth.

Hema: The interesting part about Guyana is that the Indigenous populations across the Caribbean, sometimes in some places, they are very small communities or don't even exist anymore,

Geoffrey: Yeah.

Hema: whereas in Guyana, that's not the case.

Geoffrey: Mm-hmm. So very true. And so you have, although for example, in the communities where I collected my research, my Fulbright-related research, it was one community called Imbotero, and it's right on the Barima River. It's actually somewhat of a diverse community because almost every community in Guyana is diverse.

It's not very isolated and they are, I'm sure, very isolated communities. This community happens to be somewhat diverse, predominant, I would say maybe 90% Warao folks, of course, but folks are coming in from Venezuela, from town. For example, in Imbotero, the GMCS, Guyana Marine Conservation Society, is housed in Imbotero.

And so that brings in all kinds of folks to do the work that GMCS is doing, mainly looking at the mangrove forest and its sustainability.

Hema: Guyana is geographically,is not an island. It's part of the mainland of South America. And we're not going to go down the road of, is it Caribbean, is it not? Because the culture is, um,

Geoffrey: Absolutely.

Hema: and so that's where I stand in this conversation.

Geoffrey: Mm-hmm.

Hema: I know I'm gonna get some comments of people saying, um, Guyana is not part of the Caribbean.

Geoffrey: Yeah, yeah, of course.

Hema: I disagree, and that's why it's part of this conversation on this podcast. But it is part of the mainland, right? 

Geoffrey: It is

Hema: So it has a little bit of different, when you talk about, people from other countries in South America, it's very much easier for them to their way to Guyana.

Geoffrey: Yes. Exactly. And so that's part of that, the movement of the Warao, for example, from say, Venezuela to Guyana and back and forth, right. To Suriname and so on. So it's actually, getting back to that debate, it's quite silly, I must say, the debate of whether Guyana is Caribbean or not, because of the history, right?

Which you wanna focus on, is what makes Guyana the Caribbean, not the Caribbean Sea necessarily. And it's, and the regions are the same when you think about it. It's very proximal to the Caribbean Sea, although it sits on the Atlantic Ocean, and then when we compare the traditions, the food traditions, come on. I mean, there are obviously more similarities between, the most similar ties between your Trinidad & Tobago and Guyana, because of the history too, right.

Tremendous amount of Indians were imported, if you will, into Trinidad & Tobago, just as with Guyana. It's the history and the culture, and we see it in the food, certainly, right?

But Guyana's location in South America makes it really quite fascinating. It's why our national dish, although I'm not sure how official that is, but it's definitely agreed widely that that's our national dish.

And there are others as well, that compete with pepperpot, would be one that has as its base, something that's indigenous to a product, the cassava that's indigenous to the region.

Hema: Are there any ingredients or things grown that are unique Guyana? Cassava, for example, that we've been talking about, which is widely used is also used in many different places, but when I look to maybe the wiri wiri pepper, Guyana is the only place that I see talking about that.

Geoffrey: Yeah, yeah. Oh, absolutely. So essential, just like the scotch bonnet, is to Jamaica, let's say, and, and other islands. 

But yeah, we have that uniquely and I need to do a bit more research on some of that, drill more deeply. Is it Indigenous? It might not be right. Just like plantain is very popular there, but it's from Asia, although it became very well, established even in Africa, plantain was. 

And even our metem, which is actually a Twi word, West African Twi, Akan word, which suggests “and plantain makes it good”, 'cause plantain is one of the last ingredients you put into your metem. It's the item that requires least amount of cooking. So once you add that, you've got the metem ready, as it were. 

So, yeah, so the wiri wiri pepper, so essential, adds such flavour. Every time I make my green seasoning, I feel compelled to put in some wiri wiri pepper. Great flavouring, of course I tend to take out the seeds. I'm very heat tolerant. I'm very spicy tolerant, which just, I gotta consider other folks eating my foods, right? 

And there are other traditions too, certainly ingredients. The chandon beni is huge and I love it 'cause I love cilantro too, which I think it's similar taste profile, if not totally related in some way, shape, or form. I've got chandon beni growing in my garden. I have a little kitchen garden in my little property in Guyana. So it's really cool in the heart of the city of Georgetown, mind you, right?

So, yeah, you're right. The wiri wiri pepper. Very critical, very essential. Of course, we use cassava quite a bit. I know some of the food traditions are certainly, I find very distinctive.

There's this long tradition of making stews out of any vegetable, whether it's ocro, whether it's bora, whether it's callaloo, and always mixed with some kind of protein. Such a staple, and it's usually called a stew.

It's gonna be with any of those vegetables, which makes it quite nutritious, obviously. And not always a meat protein, mind you, for the ital folks, for the vegetarians and the vegans.

Hema: It is interesting as you're talking about some of these ingredients that so many of the words crossover from Guyana to Trinidad, but then you throw in a word like bora, which is not something that I grew up using. 

Geoffrey: Oh, okay. So it's known in New York and other places as the Chinese long bean.  Typically for me, you can't have a chow mein without bora inside of it, right?

And so, I just remember my grandmother's bora and chicken, that was like a staple. She never made bora and mince, which some people do, but it's always bora and chicken. And so you find bora being imported for the Guyanese diaspora here in Brooklyn and so on.

And I'm not sure how unique bora is, 'cause it's one of those things that it's, it's all over the place named differently, like karela is another thing, something that kids always hate, I certainly hated it as a kid 'cause it's bitter. Bitter melon is the name of it beyond the Caribbean.

Hema: I imagine the moment I said, tell me about bora, and it's not a, a word I use, somebody is probably frantically typing up a message to say 'what are you talking about, Hema? We in Trinidad use that word'. I'm wondering if bora is the same as bodhi.

Geoffrey: I know, but isn't that the beauty of this sort of format, right? That we have discourse, we have ongoing dialogue, even if folks are a little left field or what, what have you. It makes for conversation, which is kind of cool.

And then, yeah, we might talk about Guyanese tradition and one thing I've learned is that, you know, foodways. There's nothing pure about it. Authenticity is, is just a word. It's not a reality, You know? There's so many variations.

I remember growing up in Guyana and being shocked by a mate who shared with me that, it was going later on in the day maybe four o'clock, five o'clock was time for us to part and go to our respective homes and there, and he tells me that he's going to eat food.

And food is a full meal. When you say food, it's like rice and a stew, I was shocked. Because we, in my house, never ate food late in the day. It was always at lunchtime, and we had tea and bread at night just as we had tea and bread and maybe eggs and that sort of thing in the morning.

So I just thought like, strange, you know, just shifted my world. I was like 12 years old or 11. I'm like, what's that about? So the, the exception is the rule. They're, they're all these diversities.

Hema: It's, it's true. And we, in Caribbean we are so diverse because of the history, and shared history to an extent. It differs slightly from country to country,

Geoffrey: Correct.

Hema: but something that you, a quote that I pulled out from one of your articles where you say, “Guyanese foodways offer optimistic stories of our history”. And then you go on to say, “Guyanese cuisine culture, a Creole unity of food traditions from at least six older cultures, is constantly responding to place, time, encounters, necessities, and creativity”. 

Geoffrey: So definitely, an opportunity, first and foremost, to celebrate Guyanese culture. As a nation, it's a young nation as all Caribbean countries are, right? So we struggle with the idea of do we have a great cuisine the way Spain does and France does, right? And so we have this opportunity to talk about our unique histories 'cause it is a unique history. Our unique histories contribute to our food traditions, Caribbean food traditions, Trinidad & Tobago food traditions, Guyanese food traditions. And I've had opportunity to go to different Caribbean islands as well and see these unique manifestations of these traditions.

And so, it's really a coming together. We, when we look at the history, we see, contributions from these various traditions. Again, the Chinese, the Madeira Portuguese, or just the Portuguese, if you will. The British, as colonizer, Indians, of course, the Indigenous, such an opportunity of this multicultural mixing, if you will, so much of, so very much. And so we get to form it. We could be, I think, careless and say, oh, it's just what it is, the society is too young, there's no authentic Guyanese tradition. There's Chinese food, but there's Guyanese-Chinese, right? And Jamaica make a similar claim as well, right?

And what is Guyanese-Chinese? Chinese food reinterpreted. Caribbean flavours, the wiri wiri peppers in there, the bora is in there, And so it's really truly an opportunity to forge the national culture, which is needed.

You know, usually there's a lot of excitement around, or there, there was a lot of excitement around independence. Here's an opportunity to create something new, to depart from our colonial legacies, if you will, and forge, a new pathway, because this idea of colonialism being oppressive, mostly serving the colonizers for the most part, enriching the metropol, that sort of thing.

And so the mother country as, as it were. But what do we now we're left with independence. Who are we, is the question that's asked. And so we have this opportunity to, in various ways, and one of the most fascinating ways is, the, the, the foodways.

Language it is important as well. We forge our unique tradition through our unique language. I love that Richard Allsopp, linguist, is the author of the dictionary of Caribbean English usage, way back in 1998. That's one of my strong influences, his ability to look in a positive way as Caribbean English as a language and expression just like you have Australian English, British English, Canadian English, American English. So there are all these world Englishes and there's Caribbean English as well. And it's colored by all that diversity, the Dutch coming in, the Indian coming in and so on. And so we have the opportunity to speak of our culture relative to food.

Food also allows us to talk about our environment. That's one of the biggest lessons that I learned last December researching in Imbotero, just the proximity of people to the land. And the relationship with food. Absolutely amazing. So it's all forming a national culture, and I'm super proud to play whatever small role I'm playing in helping to forge what is Guyanese culture and what is Caribbean culture as well.

Hema: In one of the articles, you actually have listed out each of the influences, so Indigenous, African, Indian, Portuguese, and you've added some dishes that was influenced by each of these cultures. So I'm going to leave, again, a link to that

Geoffrey: Okay.

Hema: down below so people can get some examples of what these influences might look like because, when you talk about Guyanese food, for example, a curry duck... Do you guys say, I know you say chicken curry. Do you say duck curry or curry duck?

Geoffrey: I, well, it might be generational. That's another debate like, is Guyanese Caribbean or South America, quite frankly, through touching all the hotspots here. Let me explain a bit of background. Growing up, I never heard chicken curry but supposedly that's the thing of the day, right?

And, again, you know, back to a point I made earlier, I'm not sure if it was just my household and my community, but certainly I didn't, and, and I speak to family members, they're like, yeah, that's, it was curry chicken and curry duck. Curry always came first. 

But yeah, so it, it's interesting, and it just illustrates to me that things evolve, right? So there's, there's something about, there's a culture right now that, that's the language that's being used and that's okay. I'm not gonna argue, I just know growing up it was definitely curry chicken. So, it was definitely curry duck. And I still say curry duck.

Hema: The interesting thing is if we talk about something like a curry, which has the Indian influence, which came from historically, people being brought over after the abolition of slavery as labourers because the colonizers still needed somebody to do the work. 

So we have the same history, the same people that came from South Asia, from India. But if you look at a curry from Trinidad versus a curry from Jamaica versus a curry from Guyana, it is different.

Geoffrey: Yeah.

Hema: There are different

Geoffrey: Absolutely.

Hema: flavours, different ways of making it, um, it's not exactly the same.

Geoffrey: Absolutely. And you know, would you have saijan in your curry, I suspect that you do. In Guyana, growing up, we never put saijan in our curry, which is basically moringa. But I know Indians do in Guyana, right? And they might in Trinidad as well, I'm not sure. So all these varieties, certainly, the Jamaican curry goat, just very to me, you know, we have this inside thing among Guyanese, it it's little waterish, not in taste right, but certainly it's light. It's, it's not as, as yellow.

So you're absolutely right. There are these various ways. There's fish curry, or curry fish is very popular in Guyana, and typically you'll see some whole ocro steamed in it. Just as you'll find with our shine rice, always steamed ocro on top of the shine rice, shine rice being coconut milk and rice without any peas or beans, and typically with salt fish in it, or dried shrimp. So I've given a couple of recipes there.

Hema: And you've said this before, is the food and the culture as well is not static. It is always morphing and changing.

At this point in time in history, there are a lot of people migrating from Venezuela to Trinidad, for instance, which is changing and morphing culture and cuisine. And also the political situation and the oil and gas and all of those things are bringing different people. So a dish from 10 years ago might be cooked slightly differently now.

Geoffrey: Absolutely.

Hema: But that's okay.

Geoffrey: And perfectly okay, because that's the nature of human evolution, evolution of cultures. It's just a natural process. And food is a creative process, and so you will have that diversity of expression. Food is mainly about satiation and nutrition, feeding your family, and what do you have around to put into a particular dish?

So you made reference to some of the new trends, with Guyana's new wealth, there's a need for all these new restaurants, for example, there's, the Nikkei restaurant. Nikkei is the term for this, for the Peruvian Japanese fusion food, and Victor is the chef of Nikkei, opened up just a year and a half ago,in Georgetown. He has that cuisine offering to all these new folks that are visiting Guyana, these expats and and so on. And more local Guyanese restaurants are coming to the fore as well. Lots of international hotels are coming to the fore, places like the Backyard Cafe is growing, because more more folks are going, that's a local tradition, The Backyard Cafe. We've got places like Fresh, it's, it's both great vegetarian and meat protein options. There's Oolu, which is totally vegan. This is a, a young chef who is from Canada, her parents are Guyanese. She's moved back and is offering vegan food, lunches every day. Fantastic stuff. Just fantastic stuff. So I'm having a ball relative to opportunities to just just be creative, and the opportunity to offer feedback. 'cause part of what I'm attempting to do again, is to see our culture developed. And this is just my particular lane.

There are many other lanes or pathways for us to grow our culture and develop our culture and solidify our culture. And this is just my particular way, so I'm excited. I, I call for more food reviews in Guyana. I, I work with a number of entities in Guyana that's related to food, and health in in particular.

Um, Stride592 is, is one such organization that's all about movement and healthy eating and heart health and all that good stuff. So it's, it's quite dynamic and I'm excited by the opportunities to lend my, my bit of talent to it all.

Hema: What would you say, is there any one influence that stands out as the main influence of food in Guyana, or are there a couple? Because you, you know, we talked about the six, but which cultures influenced food right now?

Geoffrey: Wow. I do. Yeah. I do think in terms of culture, I think they all do. The dominant ones are the Indian and African though, for sure. Although people are, I'm not sure there's an argument about the egg ball, which is very, very popular. And I attribute that to, to the British. The scotch egg sort of idea. Of course we're using cassava typically, sometimes potatoes used. I personally love the cassava mix, but, um, so yeah, the, the cultures, and they all, they all play a role obviously, right? Even the Portuguese were just so minimal and they, they were a strong force in Guyana at one point in the early 20th century, after they'd come and did their thing as indentured servants and became business folks and whatnot. Um, the Potiguy is is in the local parlance, as the term we, we tend to use popularly for Portuguese.

So, so they all have that influence. All the various cultures, all six heritages. But you, you asked if there is a, a particular, thing that defines, that strongly influences, um, it's hard to identify a single, I would say the, the, just the reality of the, of the climate, right? The fact that, for example, I keep coming back to the, the stews tradition.

That's something where it's very easy to have a kitchen garden in Guyana. If you see my small family property in Guyana, you know what I'm talking about. And yet I have a little kitchen garden there, very tiny space. I'm able to grow herbs and a few vegetables and callaloo and and so on and so forth.

So I would say just the environment, 'cause I increasingly want to talk about how food and how we do our food traditions have a, an absolute impact on the environment. The environment is very, very important, very determining to who we are as a food culture and who we are as a people, right?

And so to the extent that we have things are grown very, very easily, we have such access to such fresh fruits and vegetables that that really is the strong influence in, in Guyanese foodways, and it's manifested in that, I think that's stews tradition where there's always a variety of vegetables paired with a protein and there you have it, and it's the, the simplest of our dishes. You don't find it often in restaurants, but it's, it's, it's what home cooks do very, very often. Easy access to vegetable, a bit of meat protein, or which, uh, other protein, you always have rice. It's a staple, and or farine, uh, again, from cassava and such.

Hema: It's interesting that when we talk about food and food cultures and influences, it's not only the ingredients that are used, it's not only the recipes, but also the techniques that have been brought over. You know, African techniques, Indian techniques, even in the Guyanese Chinese, their techniques that are morphed into the cuisine culture.

Geoffrey: So, very true. Absolutely. Very true. So we have the, you have the tawa, in terms of the Indian tradition. For Africans, although it's not uniquely African, but you know, I grew up with my grandmother having a mortar and pestle, wooden, I still have the pestle actually. It's, it's in the family house in Guyana, um, pounding plantains to make fufu.

Um, so yeah, so there's, it's not just the recipes, it's the implements, it's the, the, techniques, and so on. Again, this, this stew tradition that, that's a technique, right?

And the, the traditions, the seven curries are very much tied to and certainly as manifested in, in, the Indian diaspora in Guyana. Various cultural, Indian cultural festivals, if you will. Any Indian tradition, Diwali, whatever, you'll see the seven curry come out. Any of the, the religious ceremonies, the seven curries will come out.

From the African, and again, those are the two dominant right traditions, but the African, when you have a queh queh right, which is a premarital ritual, you'll have conkie and you'll have cook-up rice, you know, that sort of thing.

So those are also unique, it's, it's the expression of the culture, it's what you do when you have a particular celebration. 

And just the, the hospitality, right? Is, is part of it, is part of that culture too. It's very Guyanese to, if you go to somebody's house, be offered something.

Um, not, again, not uniquely Guyanese obviously, but just speaking to that experience, the warmth, hospitality, the, the interest in your wellbeing is very, very essential.

Hema: I think that, and, you said, you know, you go to somebody's house and, and you're gonna be offered something, and it's not uniquely Guyanese. I feel like that's a Caribbean thing, right? It's a Caribbean thing. It's, we're always feeding people.

And I've heard, heard different theories around, there was once a time of scarcity and so now you are sharing what you can, and that stems from that time of scarcity.

Geoffrey: It's maybe a, you make a very good point there, it's part of this notion that there's, yeah, there's, there's all, you're very familiar with the idea of scarcity. And you might be blessed, but someone, you're not sure what that person may have eaten, and you see also in sometimes a largeness of our plates too. Um, that there might be a tradition of, well, you know, you are here, eat as much as possible. We're not sure what your situation is outside. I always want to say there's so much of it that's so human.

Hema: I wanna ask you a little bit about, as we sort of wind down, about your work, and there was one, a thing that I, that I noticed in an article, Food in the Great Land of Guyana, where you talk about seeing abandonded, unharvested harvested plots of land and farms, and people moving away from harvesting to do other work.

Geoffrey: Yeah. Yes. Yes. Um, yeah, so that, that was the great opportunity being in Imbotero, and that last article in Stabroek News, was an opportunity to talk about that very rich experience of just being on the ground, seeing how people who were super, super proximal to the land. Every family member has a plot of land that they farm, but they're oftentimes drawn away from that because it's not economically viable to do day jobs, do construction work, and so on.

There also a lot of crabbing that takes place. Um, very unique opportunity in that area. Prized, prized crab in that area, and a lot of women are, are doing the crabbing. 

So I would observe in these family farms just abandoned, plantain and banana trees loaded, toppled over by storms, and just not attended to, because they, they are pursuing something more lucrative.

And so for me it was just really interesting to observe that. It speaks to the, the pull away from the land for a lot of people. That's happened before it, it continues to happen. It's interesting to observe it taking place right now. There's tension also between what the GMCS is doing, the Guyana Marine Conservation Society, is doing in terms of preserving the, the rainforest there, the mangrove forest specifically there. And also serving as an employer, it's also pulling some folks away from, from the land, and you know, I'm not trying to be idealistic that folks need to be agrarian and what have you, but there's certainly that tension there and it was interesting to observe and to see that there really is a relationship between the, the, the characteristics of one's food tradition and one proximity to the land, and the relationship to the environment. 

I, I was happy to be able to contribute some of those ideas to GMCS 'cause I think they tend not to have too much time to look at sort of the human factor, of their conservation work. And so it was a great partnership. They were my research host, and so I was able to help provide some insights there. 

There are a couple of farm I, in the article I spoke about and I continue to write about, there are two larger farmers and their imports, actually from Venezuela specifically. One's Guyanese.

He had, um, left, went to Venezuela and returned recently to do farming. And oh, actually both of their stories, both men, really mirror what the, the small farmers are experiencing, right? So I just really appreciate this opportunity to tell, help, tell their stories to see how we can help shape policies that help us to pull as much as possible from the land in a sustainable way. That was just a really, really rich, rich experience, being able to see the dynamic of how we relate to the land.

The practice of kitchen gardens, of course, but there's something more profound in the rural areas, more profound stories about that relationship between humans and, and food. And food and the food systems that are tied to our environment.

Hema: Has your work with, as a Fulbright scholar, come to an end?

Geoffrey: Uh, no, no, it hasn't actually. It, it might come to an end when I finish this manuscript that I'm working on currently. I think I'm pitching it to Gastronomica, which is a academic food journal. Uh, but in terms of Fulbright, I will, I'm sure it'll be called upon to do some things related to the incoming class. I have a, a presentation scheduled with GMCS, my research partner in Imbotero. This is just the beginning, it's a springboard. Now I am absolutely hungry and thirsty to get into other parts of Guyana and other parts of the Caribbean as well, to, to just explore and to learn about our dynamic food traditions and food systems and how it's tied to our larger cultures, as a Caribbean people, and how we are as, as, human beings relating to our environment through food.

Hema: It food is such a, a gateway conversation to much else, to history, to the people and the culture, that I'm excited to see what comes next for you and, learn a little bit more once this manuscript has come to fruition and is out there in the public.

Geoffrey: Thank you.

Hema: But in the meantime, is there any last words that you'd like people to know about food culture in Guyana?

Geoffrey: Huh. So, just that we need to look at food more seriously. It's understandable that food is a given. It's a pervasive reality. It's something we've gotta do. In fact, there's an African West African proverb, I believe that says that there's no God quite like our stomach, 'cause we should, as we must make sacrifice to it every day.

But we tend to just look at as, oh, it's what it is, it's just, we gotta eat, but it's such, it could be such an amazing aspect of our culture. Many other cultures, other national cultures have celebrated their food traditions, their cuisine, and have reaped tremendous benefit from it not just financial, but cultural and national benefit.

And so I think Guyana can do the same. We have the, the stuff that it takes and we just need more people like myself and, and yourself, to help promote our, our rich and diverse and dynamic food culture.

Hema: Geoffrey, thank you so much for joining me today on The Moreish Podcast. I so look forward to hearing what is next for you in some of the work that you're doing.

Geoffrey: Thank you very much, Hema. This was a great opportunity. Much appreciated.